"Rediscovering" Old Patterns

Discussion in 'Fly Tying' started by Thom Collins, Jul 6, 2013.

  1. Guy Gregory Active Member

    Posts: 453
    Spokane, WA.
    Ratings: +44 / 0
    The Renegade will no longer catch cutthroat.
  2. Jim Speaker Active Member

    Posts: 2,215
    Mill Creek, WA
    Ratings: +518 / 0
    When I was a kid my grandpa (Carl Nilsson) taught me to tie, and introduced me to the man that was Roy Patrick's friend, that took over his shop after his passing. (if anyone remembers his name I'd heartily thank you) I learned to tie at his kitchen table on a Thompson Model-A with a copy of the Patrick's Fly Shop pattern book. I found it disconcerting that when I walked in there as an adult, Jimmy knew nothing of that old pattern book and had never even heard of a Montana Bucktail. Never went back... not the same shop as it was - all about thousands spent on rod building materials these days was my take. No time for me and my Montana Bucktails that kinda sounded like what I might mean is a stimulator. Randall Kaufman developed the stimulator from the base pattern Montana Bucktail. Yeah, that's not what I meant. Go back to selling rod building stuff young man... make your dough... my small time needs re golden pheasant tippet, true orange dubbing, and such won't make your fortune. (huh? what's true orange? well it aint orange, pal... and you don't sell it)

    There was a saying in that old fly tying book that had been forgotten, referring to coastal cutthroat if my memory hasn't completely failed, it said: "If they won't take a Montana bucktail you might as well go home."

    Well... it's a fine old pattern. And, in my youth I believe the saying, as it was what I tied on when all else was failing - and it usually produced - or I'd go home.

    I was well pleased to find that my new bud and recent comrade on the little Deschutes not only knew of them, but to my utter surprise produced one from his box and started nailing coastal cutties on it. If a day on Lake Crescent hadn't already solidified our friendship, this miraculous production of a mostly forgotten but stellar pattern from his box with no ado at all, me gaping that someone on the planet actually knew of it - this produced a solid "RIGHT ON" from an old part of me that goes way back to grandpa's kitchen table and a thompson model A.
  3. Tim Cottage Formerly tbc1415

    Posts: 1,694
    Outer Duvall
    Ratings: +249 / 1
    Jim would you please post a picture of the Montana Bucktail. I'm not finding the pattern in Patrick's book, Tie Your Own Flies.
    Maybe its in another book by Roy Patrick.

    Thanks
    TC
  4. Jim Speaker Active Member

    Posts: 2,215
    Mill Creek, WA
    Ratings: +518 / 0
    [IMG]

    Here's one I found online (I'm at work...) Kinda a sloppy tie, but this is the pattern.
    Gary Knowels likes this.
  5. Jim Speaker Active Member

    Posts: 2,215
    Mill Creek, WA
    Ratings: +518 / 0
  6. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,248
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,716 / 0
    That's right. If you have any, you may as well toss them in the garbage. If it doesn't have CDC on it somewhere, there is no way it will catch a trout.
  7. Jim Speaker Active Member

    Posts: 2,215
    Mill Creek, WA
    Ratings: +518 / 0
    CDC is soooo last year... nowadays if it's not purple it will only offend the fish.
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  8. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,248
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,716 / 0
    For awhile it had to be a "cripple" or fergetaboutit.
  9. bitterroot Love vintage graphite!

    Posts: 1,428
    Montana
    Ratings: +215 / 1
    Jim Speaker likes this.
  10. Jim Speaker Active Member

    Posts: 2,215
    Mill Creek, WA
    Ratings: +518 / 0
    This thread has me wanting to tie some flies from my youth - can't wait for my Pacific Northwest Fly Patterns book to arrive so I can wax nostalgic as I tie Parmachene Belles, California Coachmans, Royal Coachmans, Carrots, etc. Heck I might even have to tie a Cow Dung just say I caught a fish on a Cow Dung!
  11. Jim Speaker Active Member

    Posts: 2,215
    Mill Creek, WA
    Ratings: +518 / 0
    Anyone know where to buy True Orange floss? Ya know, the color that you'd swear is kinda yellow but it's not?
  12. psycho Active Member

    Posts: 364
    B.C. Canada
    Ratings: +142 / 0
    I have that book down in my fly book library.:D
  13. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,248
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,716 / 0
    When I first started fishing The Metolius in the 70s, the guy who owned the restaurant/fly shop claimed a black Stove Pipe was the pattern to use. I'd never heard of one before. I bought a few and had marginal success with the things.

    I never bothered to tie my own.

    Decades later I was fishing The Met and found a Stove Pipe with a variegated black and olive body on the bank. Evidently it dropped off someone's drying patch.

    I tied it on and started catching trout like crazy.

    So, I did tie up some of these simple guys.

    The Stove Pipe:

    [IMG]
  14. Jim Ficklin Genuine Montana Fossil

    Posts: 2,422
    Columbia Basin
    Ratings: +692 / 0
    I have "The Fisherman's Encyclopedia" (also the "Hunter's" version) that passed to me when Dad left this world & went fishing in the everlasting. There are a treasure of old methods, photos, info, history, & color plates in both. Copyright is 1950, 2 years after I arrived. Here's a few more old trout patterns:
    Professor, Quill Gordon, Silver Doctor, Queen of the Waters, & the venerable Mickey Finn and Robert Page Lincoln streamers.
  15. GAT Active Member

    Posts: 4,248
    Willamette Valley, OR
    Ratings: +2,716 / 0
    I know a guy who used a Queen of the Waters on The Deschutes during the salmon fly hatches and it worked quite well for him. I never took a look at the pattern... guess I should have.
  16. Steve Vaughn Member

    Posts: 322
    Richland, WA
    Ratings: +49 / 0
    I would add the Tupp's Indispensable; and excellent pattern for the eastern Sulfur hatches. I think it was the use of a few strands of red seal fur in the yellow dubbing. Gives the fly a real depth appearance.

    Steve
  17. zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

    Posts: 3,261
    Moses Lake, WA
    Ratings: +1,035 / 1
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  18. Thom Collins Active Member

    Posts: 204
    Kirkland, WA
    Ratings: +65 / 0
    Hope you posts some pics!
  19. zen leecher aka bill w born to work, forced to fish

    Posts: 3,261
    Moses Lake, WA
    Ratings: +1,035 / 1
    Jim, You might consider joining the married wing fly swap.
  20. Gary Knowels Active Member

    Posts: 1,113
    Seattle, WA
    Ratings: +419 / 0
    I haven't rediscovered anything as they are new to me, but I've been using simple floss bodies partridge soft hackles a lot lately and they have become my most effective flies. I like to hang them as a dropper off a bushy dry when fish are rising, or behind a heavy point fly while indicator nymphing. Such a simple and effective fly, and I can tie them in no time. Here's to hoping I never forget about them.
    Jim Wallace and Thom Collins like this.