NFR Your Seattle Mariners.

Discussion in 'Fly Fishing Forum' started by Old Man, Apr 20, 2014.

  1. Old Man

    Old Man Just an Old Man

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    This early in the season and these guys stink big time. 6 in a row now lost. Somebody wrote in the baseball world that the Mariners had many arms to choose from. Well I think they choose the wrong ones. Christ the Relief arms suck. They couldn't get out a team form the little leagues. I thought this new manager was a winner. Well he's just a loser as far as I can see.

    I thought from preseason that things would be better. You pay mucho bucks for a ex Yankee and he's not even hitting .300. $4 million for a closer and he can't even close out a game. This looks like it's going to be a looooonnnngggg season. They can only go up, because only Houston is below them. And they have sucked for many years.

    I can only get the Mariner games here. I wish I could get the Rockies instead.
     
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  2. Paul_

    Paul_ Active Member

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    I usually don't jump off the M's bandwagon until at least June, I think I'm going to bail now.
     
  3. Danielocean

    Danielocean Steelhead Virgin

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    I say get rid of em.
     
  4. jake-e-boy

    jake-e-boy No mas

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    don't give up faith ppl! this is why we won't ever have another nba team....
     
  5. Bruce Baker

    Bruce Baker Active Member

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    I haven't watched one game yet this year. Don't start blaming the manager just yet. I think the onus is more on the players. They're not playing up to their capabilities. The first round picks have done squat.

    Maybe it's something in the water. Former Mariners seem to do quite well after they leave Seattle.
     
  6. IveofIone

    IveofIone Active Member

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    I'm with you Bruce, I can't stand to watch them. If any team ever defined "they snatched defeat from the jaws of victory" it is the Mariners. The TV broadcast are like minor league fare, Angie the Cow is still making us cringe, Simms has multiple orgasms any time they get ahead or someone hits a home run and the last time I tuned in they were posting Tweets from the fans during the game. Hard to call that crap major league.

    I don't hate the Mariners by any means, I would love to see them do well but their broadcast product is so bush league it is hard to get interested.

    Having been a Dodger fan since 1946 it seems as though I have listened to Vin Scully almost my entire adult life. Always impartial, always professional he remains a Rembrandt in an era of cartoonist as far as announcers go. Simms on the other hand recites statistics relentlessly and diminishes the game rather than enlarging the big picture. Just an intolerable bore to listen to.

    Go Dodgers-screw the Yankees

    Ive
     
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  7. Charles Sullivan

    Charles Sullivan dreaming through the come down

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    The M's TV broadcast is difficult to listen to. It's a truly awful product.

    Vin Scully is like listening to the first bite of cheescake. Smooth, rich, satisfying.

    Go Sox,
    cds
     
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  8. Ed Call

    Ed Call Mumbling Moderator Staff Member

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    Ive, you won me over with screw the Yankees.
     
  9. bennysbuddy

    bennysbuddy the sultan of swing

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    There is a god!
     
  10. Stonefish

    Stonefish Triploid, Humpy & Seaplane Hater

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    As long as I have pro and college football as well as college basketball, I'm good sports viewing wise.
    The M's ship sank a long time ago.
    SF
     
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  11. teedub

    teedub Active Member

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    I like to record car dealer commercials and turn down the sound on the TV games with that wanna be Sims and play the gar dealer crap instead of him. The team sucks because of that idiot Jack z. He can make any hitter into a 180 hitter just by signing them. The league is scattered with good players he got rid of.
     
  12. Porter

    Porter Active Member

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    Don't you have a single A or AA team in Montana that you can go complain about....geez! :p
     
  13. Gary Knowels

    Gary Knowels Active Member

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    That's not the reason at all. The reason there will not be an NBA team here in the near future (~10 years) is that the NBA doesn't want one here. There isn't enough talent to expand, plus the owners don't want to split profits with another owner since the value of a franchise is skyrocketing right now. Seattle is a bargaining chip that the NBA can use to coerce cities in to paying for new arenas with tax-payer money. "Build us a new arena, on your dime, or else we will just move to Seattle. After all, they have owners willing to overpay market value by 50% for a franchise and an approved stadium plan in place and they will break ground on that the day the sale and move is finalized."

    As far as the Mariners go, I'm a diehard. I love the team and go to 20-30 games per year. The pitching is hampered with 3 of their top 4 pitchers on the DL so that will improve over the next couple of months. What concerns me is the hitting and they manner in which they are losing close ball games. players with solid track records aren't living up to those standards or improving on them as they should be (Kyle Seager), reclamation projects haven't panned out yet (Logan Morrison, Corey Hart), and the young guys aren't fulfilling their promise (Brad Miller, Abraham Almonte).

    Good news, 144 more games to go. Win 74 of them and you're a .500 team.
     
  14. Shad

    Shad Active Member

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    Agreed with last poster on NBA thing. The NBA is an organization of extortionists and scoundrels. After the way they screwed Seattle over last time around, I can't understand why anyone would want to get in bed with those crooks again. If you need to follow an NBA team, go to Portland. They come up here to support the Seahawks....

    As for the M's, I've had some of these same thoughts while occasionally catching critical moments in their recent string of horrific losses on the TV and radio.

    As only a casual follower of baseball, I think the Mariners' problem over the past decade plus has come down to a lack of protection in the batting order for the few top tier free agents they have picked up. Hitting is contagious, whether good or bad. Even the most talented hitters are hugely more productive when the guys in front of them and behind them are hitting, for the simple reason that opposing pitchers can't pitch around the big bats if the guys coming up are also threats to hit in a given at-bat. When good hitters get good pitches to hit, good things happen.

    I think we've seen evidence that most of these guys are capable hitters, but I think the chronic swoons they have all taken in the past few seasons have made it easy for them to lose confidence in their hitting as soon as they start to struggle a bit. Eventually, even the guys who have been performing well fall victim, as opposing pitchers simply stop throwing them strikes, knowing the next guy will be an easy out.

    I think the Mariners are suffering from trying to mix management philosophies. Some teams (Yankees, Angels, etc.) win by spending on multiple free agents. Others (Oakland) win with a Schneider/Carrollesque philosophy of creating a competitive atmosphere among young, raw players. The Mariners seem to be caught somewhere in the middle, trying to get one big signing to lift up the rest of a team of chronic underachievers.

    The Canos and Beltres have been great acquisitions, but the organization's refusal to get one or two additional, proven bats has made them look pedestrian. Get both those guys on the same team, and then you've got something. As an individual, no one player can make a team a winner. As has been mentioned, as soon as these guys go to a team that has multiple batting threats, they become great players again. I think that's because they start getting pitches to hit again, and seeing guys around them having success takes pressure off them and makes them more confident.

    It also seems like a big part of why the Mariners go on extended streaks of poor hitting is that they are too aggressive at the plate. Seems like nothing anywhere close to the strike zone gets by them, and they try to hit tough pitches too often. Sure, if you've got two strikes, you should swing at anything close, but if you don't like the pitch, try to foul it off instead of rolling over on it and starting another double play. Good hitting teams can usually force pitchers to throw meaty pitches by not trying to hit their best pitches. If nothing else, taking a few pitches and fighting off a few others gets a hot pitcher's pitch count up earlier in the game, increasing the likelihood of getting to face a pitcher who isn't on his game later on.

    Anyway, like most here, I've more or less lost interest. Some people say that makes us bad baseball fans, but I'd argue that only a fool chooses to spend his entertainment dollars on a consistently sub-par product.
     
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  15. Red Arch

    Red Arch Active Member

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    Before people stop dropping the M's as the worst team of the league etc, look at what happened to the Oakland Athletics when they set the record for most games won in a row for the AL in 2002.

    If I remember correctly, they started the year with a horrible record, then managed to turn it around and win the AL West. It is not even the end of the first month, there are lots of games left.

    Also how many teams have the M's played, 4? That must not help at all.
     
  16. Gary Knowels

    Gary Knowels Active Member

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    Shad,
    Some of the increases in performance we've seen from ex-Ms on new teams has to do with ballpark as well as team fit. Beltre is the shiniest example. We overpaid for a right handed pull first fly ball hitter to play in THE worst hitter's park in the league. As soon as he goes to Boston and every long fly out to left in Seattle becomes a double off the monster or Texas where the wind blows out of a warm air park with small dimensions, he looks like a hall of fame guy again.

    I don't buy in to a lot of the ideology theories that people like to throw around. I think it is much simpler than that. While the scouting, drafting, and trade results have gotten rave reviews at the time from people in the business, nearly all of them in the Jack Z era haven't panned out. Some of that is bad luck (see all 3 of "big 3 pitchers" hurt right now) but some of that has to be the people in place that are teaching in the minor leagues. Only 1 out of 3 pitchers drafted in the 1st round make it to have a 5 year career in the bigs. The track record across baseball is much better for batters, but not in Seattle. Smoak was a top proscpect with Texas, Montero the Yankees #1 prospect, Ackley was "guaranteed to hit", and it keep going. Something is happening in this organization that guys perform well in the minors, get promoted, look promising, but then can't hit. And I'm pretty certain that its the fact that none of them can hit big league level off-speed pitches. Minor league instruction needs to change to fix this.
     
  17. Olive bugger

    Olive bugger Active Member

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    You guys are way too critical of the Mariners. Early season or no, they are just seeking their comfort zone. The basement.
     
  18. Old Man

    Old Man Just an Old Man

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    I think I started this thread because not to many were going out and going fishing. We had a few good reports but not to many and this is a fly fishing site. Sports seems to stir up a lot of talk about how bad they are vs. how good the are. I'll probably watch them again tonight as Felix is pitching. He does good. And then his relief undoes it for him. Or maybe I'm just bored.
     
  19. jake-e-boy

    jake-e-boy No mas

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    suck it you band wagon jumpers, streak broken!
     
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  20. freestoneangler

    freestoneangler Not to be confused with Freestone

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    I think they're just still hung over from the Seahawks party. Knowing their chances to have a parade were about as good as Seattle's Big Dig project coming in on time and under budget, they doubled down.
     

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